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Is Freedom Worth Dying For?

Posted 15 December 2005, 2.42 pm by HockeyGod

Germany just passed a new law that says all telecommunication companies must store all information to be searched at a later date by the government to help prevent terrorism.

This includes all Internet, Cell Phone, Land Line, SMS, text messages, etc. Anything that has a signal that travels through a medium that's not yours is now recorded.

Slashdot says it's 1984 in Europe, which begs the question: Is Freedom Worth Dying For?

A long time ago, our forefathers thought it was, but I can't say the same is true of today's society. We're willing, if not eager to give up any of our freedoms to prevent a possible terrorist incident.

You're cowards, all of you.

Since when are our individual lives more important than the ideals our founding fathers fought for? If Jefferson knew we were giving up so many rights in exchange for a false sense of security against "terrorism" he'd have a stroke.

With freedom comes consequences. A long time ago people viewed these concequences as neccessary for the good of the whole. It's because of them we can work the jobs we choose, live where we want, worship the Gods we choose, and think what we want to think. People died horrible deaths, but because of them society continued to prosper.

These ideals are slowly being challenged however, and in a self righteous bid to "protect the children" we're actually condeming them to an Orwellian future.

Stand up for your rights people. The terrorists don't need to attack our freedoms anymore, we're doing a pretty good job of destroying them ourselves.

cyprusudo
on 18 December 2005, 3.08 pm
They are just starting? Been going on here (USA) for years now. We log everything. Take a look at your telephone agreement. They always make the statement that you are liable for all debt incurred and any illegal activity conducted is sublect to a shitload of federal statutes. It will continue to inform you that all calls may be monitored for 'Training and Quality Control' Now, If I'm 'training' and I overhear someone committing a crime, It would be illegal for me to not report it. Internet? You mean the system set up in the 60's allowing US military bases to network? Everything goes through a 'clearing house'. It always has. This clearing house filters traffic and flags streams that hit for keywords. They felt it was necessary way back when... Just to keep an eye on things. Believe it or not, Yer best bet for secure communication is on a digital cell phone network. Sure, they can log numbers but, it's pretty much machine code after that.


HockeyGod
on 20 December 2005, 3.27 pm
Do you have any evidence of this "clearing house"?

I've done a tracert on my path to various websites, emails, instant messages etc... and none of them seem to go to the same place.

Call monitoring at a company is different than wiretapping. If I call the water department, I expect them to monitor my call. It's their right, they're on one end of that conversation.

If I call Alex, I don't expect anybody else not in my house or Al's house to be listening.


cyprusudo
on 20 December 2005, 4.38 pm
http://www.tiaonline.org/standards/carnivore/


cyprusudo
on 20 December 2005, 5.02 pm
Way I see it, The government runs 15 to 20 years ahead of popular technology. Recently, local media reported that F22 'raptors' were being deployed after testing at Nellis. This is what I know for sure. I saw a raptor twice in the early 90's...93?-94? Both times, it flew in from the north(bum-fucked nevada). Nellis hosted an air show that was positively amazing in 95. Featured was a low level, low speed fly over by a B-2 stealth. (another great example) Lockheed propaganda littered the place. I told a lockheed rep that I'd seen a few of the 'raptors' flying into nellis. He categorically denied that a flyable model had ever been at Nellis. He seemed almost embarrassed to spout the 'party line'. I know better.


pH5.5
on 20 December 2005, 7.11 pm
if you call your landline phone company here in the UK they can recite all of your conversations back to you no problems - they've got the whole lot stored.


Spooky
on 20 February 2006, 3.35 am
Perhaps YOU shouldn't be ranting about this over the internet. Perhaps we shouldnt' all be so reliant on technology, too, but what it really comes down to is CONVEINANCE. Give up your conveinance? Not likely.

Furthermore, it's all well and good to rant with righteous indignantion at the cowardice of your countryman, but just shouting "Raise the Fist!" acheives nothing but an elevated noise level.


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